Hazel English

“I don't really ever write with the intention of knowing where it's going to go. It's important not to think about that stuff in the moment.”

For Hazel English, the best creative process involves writing without aim or direction.

The best writing process sometimes involves not really having a plan. That may sound counterintuitive, but I think it makes sense. To Hazel English, the writing ritual involves writing every day, but writing without purpose. This stream-of-consciousness style take the pressure off English. And without pressure, it’s much easier to create. By her own account, English often finds it hard to summon the motivation to write, and being flexible with when and where she writes prevents her from making excuses.

Hazel English’s debut full-length Wake Up! is out now on Polyvinyl Records. I love it. I’m a big fan of the 60s vibe. You can watch our interview below or read the transcription. (The transcribed version has been edited for clarity.)

Outside of songwriting, how much writing do you do?

A

I like to start my day with writing, generally just freewriting stream of consciousness. I don't really like to set a specific time for myself. I like to write for as long as it feels good to just get anything onto the page. And usually it spurs me onto something else, but I usually don't have a goal in mind.

Is the goal to turn those ideas into songs?

A

I don't really ever write with the intention of knowing where it's going to go. It's important not to think about that stuff in the moment. I'm going to write a lot of crappy stuff, so I'm not putting any pressure on myself to make it into something else. Often I find that that when I don't put any pressure on myself, something really cool happens unexpectedly. And then I might use bits and pieces of that for a song. But with a lot of my stream of consciousness stuff, no one will see 95% of it and that's fine with me.

Do you think it’s important to write every day?

A

Yes, because it creates a habit. It's funny, even though I love writing, I find it hard to motivate myself to write. It's the same with music. I love playing music, but I still find it hard to motivate myself to pick up a guitar. So it's a lot easier if I'm just in the habit of doing it. Then my mind doesn't start to think about all the reasons why I shouldn't do that thing. I just do it automatically.

Besides writing every day, do you have certain rituals to the process?

A

That's a really interesting question because I've also really been thinking about rituals a lot lately. Rituals are really important, and I'm only just starting to understand how helpful they can be to unblocking things emotionally. This is a little off topic, but I struggle to express blocked emotions or to even connect emotions in my body. So I heard about this ritual, which I've just started trying, where if you're stuck in an emotion, like you're angry about something, or you're sad about something, you write it on a piece of paper—the feeling and why you're feeling it—and then you rip it up and throw it away. There's something about the physical embodiment of ripping up the paper and removing that thing from your environment that has been helping me a lot.

Rituals with the creative process are also really important to get me into that mindset. When I'm doing any activity, I need hyperfocus. I can't even really listen to music in the background if I'm writing. I put away all computers or social media. I write in a book, and I'm not picky about my books. I go through them so quickly, so I just buy the cheapest ones. I know some people like a really nice journal, but I'm not picky by that.

“I do find the morning to be a good time of the day. I’m not thinking about anything, and I can do it straight away. I’m a little hazy because my mind is not giving me all these reasons to stop me.”

The ritual gives me confidence. It's that routine that makes me feel like, well, I've done this before and it's worked. So that's going to put me in the right space. John Darnielle from The Mountain Goats told me he wrote his last album at the dining room table because "that's where the mojo was." Another songwriter told me recently that she likes to always write with flowers on the table because that makes her feel like she's more productive. I do find, though, that songwriters are very particulars about their writing instrument. They are very possessive about the types of pens and pencils that they use.

A

Honestly, I haven't figured out my favorite because I just use what's available to me. But I do notice that the pens I like are always the ones I don't buy for myself, and then I can never find them again. I'll write with anything. Same with journals, but I think that when people have things they like to use, the familiarity of that favorite thing puts them in that mood.

Does time or place matter to you?

A

I think it's a little limiting to think of it in that way. And it's just another reason for me to put excuses up as to why I can't write today because I'm not in the right space. I'm trying to overcome those ideas of inspiration and motivation and just tell myself that I can write at any time. But I do find the morning to be a good time of the day. I'm not thinking about anything, and I can do it straight away. I'm a little hazy because my mind is not giving me all these reasons to stop me.

 I just feel fresh and motivated in the morning. I would say I'm a morning person, but I don't get up early. I just find that I'm more willing to work in the morning.

Let’s define morning, because that could be someone else’s afternoon.

A

I would say around eight to nine, but it's been fluctuating a little bit during quarantine. I've been sleeping in a little bit more because my sleeping patterns have been a little disrupted and I haven't been sleeping as well.

You mentioned something earlier about writing a lot of garbage. That's something a few songwriters have told me. Nils Lofgren from Bruce Springsteen's E Street Band mentioned that to me: an important part of his process is writing through the crap before the good stuff.

A

That's about figuring out my own thoughts because at first they're all jumbled up in my brain. So until I get them out on the page, often I'm not even aware of these unconscious things floating around. The first step is just getting it all on the page and then editing later. For me it's important not to edit as I go. Inevitably a lot of the stuff is going to be nonsense or not that interesting. But that's fine. The important part is not to judge because among those paragraphs of nonsense, there's a little gem.

What other types of writing do you like to do?

A

I grew up writing stories. That always been my thing, and I think I imagined myself first off as a writer, maybe as a novelist or something, before I really thought of myself as a vsongwriter. I've been writing stories and poems for a long time, but I don't really share that much of it. I do have a little writing group and we all write together.

Does that type of writing make you a better songwriter?

A

I don't really know, but I typically keep it pretty separate. Up until now, I haven't employed that much narrative in my songwriting. It's usually pretty personal. But that might change. I don't try to bring poetry into the lyrics because it disrupts the flow for me. I'm more melody focused. I'll come up with the melody first and then come up with the lyrics. But lyrics are very important to me. I am very obsessive about making sure that they are meaningful and express what I'm trying to say.

Do you revise a lot of your lyrics?

A

Sometimes I'll come up with a line just to fill the space that I think I'm going to change later. But often I can't change it because it suddenly feels like such a big part of the hook. There were a few changes I made lyrically from the demos to the finished songs on this last album, but these were not significant changes. Sometimes I have gone back and tried to change lyrics and then realized that it was better before. Sometimes you just have to let it be.

What was the easiest song on the new album to write?

A

I would say "Five and Dime.” Every element from the writing to the recording process was just really easy. We recorded it in a day. There weren't really any changes that needed to be made. Sometimes you just get into that zone.

And what was the most difficult song?

A

I would say "Shaking" because I went back and made a lot of changes. There were a lot of different versions of it before I was happy. I don't think that song was difficult to write; most of the time, the writing is the easiest part of the process.

I usually write a song within a day. I don't tend to linger on songs, so if I’m finding that they're not coming within a day or two, I generally feel like it's not a good song. Or I'll just put it away and come back to it later.

If I hear you correctly, if a song isn’t working, maybe it’s not worth pursuing?

A

Yeah, often I feel that way. I have a short attention span, and if I get too frustrated with a song that's just not coming together, I would just prefer to not have to deal with it anymore.

I read an interview with a songwriter recently, I think it was Don Henley, who said a lot of songs came to him when loading the dishwasher. That made me wonder: is being bored important to the creative process?

A

I think it's true. I don't think you need to be bored necessarily, but just not really thinking too much about it. Often when your mind's on something else or on some mundane task, it tends to wander and that's when you allow for these creative ideas to flow. Often I get ideas when I'm in the shower or when I'm riding my bike. It's when my mind is elsewhere.

Let's end with this. I always like to talk about books, and I find that songwriters love to read. Who do you like to read? Do any writers influence your songwriting?

A

I love science fiction. I love Phillip K Dick. He's probably my favorite writer, and I love Kurt Vonnegut. Vonnegut just has this amazing style. It's very amusing and playful. I just like how playful it is.A book that really influenced this album was Society of the Spectacle by Guy Debord, who is part of this movement called the Situationists. I like to read a lot of books from the avant garde movement too. That really inspires me, like the Dadas and the surrealists.

I also love Vonnegut's word economy, but I can definitely see playfulness being a part of it too. How did Society of the Spectacle influence Wake Up?

A

The book was written in the sixties, and it feels very ahead of its time. I came back to it when I was in my last year of university working on my thesis. I reread it, and it hit even harder this time. Debord talks about the idea of the spectacle, which is this concept of society as a means of appearances instead of real lived experiences. It really made me think of the internet a lot and how we're constantly projecting ideas of ourselves on screen. And it feels quite disconnected from how we live our lives. I was feeling a lot of anxiety from that kind of disconnected feeling, and I wanted to get back to living my life in a more meaningful and connected way. Especially now, when it's even harder to disconnect from screens. I have to make rules for myself about how much time I spend online.

What books are you reading right now?

A

I'm reading And Then There Were None by Agatha Christie. I started a book club with some of my friends and I didn't even realize this book was really popular, so I thought it would be a good starting point. This is my first book of hers that I've read.

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